Log in or Sign up. Hi, I'm new here. Not new to the car hobby itself but relatively new to Buicks, or at least the technical aspects of them. I have a chance to buy a out of an Electra with all the brackets, pulleys, accessories, etc.
Is this a good choice or should I look for a ? I remember reading a comment once about a being bored to inches, but this is. Sounds like a bunch to me. Has anyone on these boards ever done this? A sonic test would certainly be performed before proceding, but by the time I got to that point I would have had already bought the engine and torn it down, so knowing if it is even possible ahead of time would be valuable information.
The reason I ask is because it appears that the has the most available choices for parts pistons.
I will modify this engine a little, so I can use any information on head port sizes, crank and rod strength in comparison to theetc. Any help on this topic will be greatly appreciated. Thank you very much in advance. I am looking forward to participating on the V8 Buick site. Golden Oldie 65Mar 4, It depends on what you are after.
If you want to have fun and not worry about being the fastest the will be fine.
I haven't looked in a while to see what pistons are available for s, but there are more choices for s. What year is it? If it's a '67 it should have the better heads. Well, I would like it to run pretty strong. I just wondered if the had the potential of theminus the 25 cubic inches. I realize there are many determining factors for this, but my biggest concern now with the would be the stock compression ratio for todays pump gas if I cannot find a piston replacement for the to lower it, which I realize would also lower the power output.
I don't know what year the is offhand. I'm on a learning curve here with the BB Buicks, but I'm also old enough to know that it's better, or at least cheaper to learn from the experience, or mistakes, of others. Maybe a set of those new Edelbrock heads? What are the combustions chamber sizes for the 's and the 's, by year? Perhaps I should look for a later to start with, but how late? Do they get weaker as they get newer, or just slower. If it's slower, that can be remedied, but weaker is more expensive to overcome.
Thank you for your help. The Eldebrock heads are untested. Also ask TA about piston options and boring.Some engines are just destined to be overshadowed it seems. The ci Buick is one of those engines. Introduced at the same time as the ci engine init was essentially a bored out version of that engine.
Buick V8 For 4/30: The 430/400/455, Nailhead, And More
In the would show up and essentially send the packing into the annals of Buick history as a good mill but it never got or gets the love that the big continues to get today. That was a recipe for a couple of things but one of them was burnouts for days. The compression was Remember that whole no replacement for displacement thing? Well, they were right. Clear as mud? The nailhead started as then grew to but was called the Buick had a new motor in the wings, and it was ci but then grew to The easiest way to tell — the valve cover gaskets on the are parallel with the ground, the is canted like most chevy motors.
Buick had the and before the The usually went into the land yachts because my sister had a 69 Riveria with the Maybe a but more likely a Point is, any of those Buick engines will burn the tires as long as you care to keep your foot down. My father had a 67 Wildcat, I learned to drive on it. That thing would burn the tires for as long as you stayed in the throttle. The is not a nail head it was the new engine design introduces in 67 along with the Share This 0. Brian Lohnes.There's no question that cubic inches of displacement equal a big motor.
Nevertheless, this giant engine from the General is a little mysterious.
430 HP vs 455 HP
In the beginning, you would find them in Oldsmobile Motor Division products. As time went on you started seeing this exact displacement under the hood of Buicks and performance models from the Pontiac Motor Division. Here we'll dig into the history of the record torque producing big block. Discover if the Buick, Pontiac or Oldsmobile engine has an advantage over the other. Finally, learn how the benefited during a time when GM's divisions took great pride in making their own engines.
Olds beat the other GM divisions to market with the first Cubic Inch motor. In the engine found its way into Oldsmobile's premium luxury muscle car, the They called it the Rocket which became an excellent marketing tool. They based the engine off of the CID found in the Toronado. The company actually retained the same size bore yet increased the stroke by altering the crankshaft.
The side effects of a longer stroke include a healthy increase in torque. The downside is the engine finds itself a little slower at gathering RPMs. Horsepower ratings from through remained in the to HP range. At first, the engines remained exclusive to the Toronado, Cutlass and 's. The Buick version of the is actually quite different from the Oldsmobile version. For this reason, GM considered it a thin-walled big block.
The advantage of this casting design is a significant drop in weight over the other versions. In fact, the engine actually weighed close to pounds less than the legendary big block that Chevy used.
This weight reduction compensated for slightly lower horsepower output from the Buick version. This engine had a short run starting in In General Motors started using the same engines across the different divisions and platforms. For this reason, you often find an Oldsmobile under the hood of a or later Buick model. In Pontiac really didn't have a small block engine.
In an effort to keep things simple Pontiac designed all their V-8 engines around the same casting. Even the small displacement CID motor is considered a big block. Therefore, the Tri-power Trophy engine is also based off of the block casting. Fast forwarding to Pontiac altered the bore and stroke to produce the When rolled around, Pontiac offered their largest displacement in the company's history.Our Address. Kings Mills, OH To the people who grew up with these motors, which one of these s was the best?
I actually prefer the buickthat made that buick riveria fly! Ah, good info. Andrew, thanks for the block pictures btw. Which one of these is the most expensive to build? As a ballpark the Pontiac is the cheapest of the three due to sheer volume and parts interchangablity. There are more good aftermarket parts for the Buick than olds, although yea, they can be costly. Last of the super good forged old stuff beginning of 68, first good olds forged stuff was 65… small window of time.
Buick s that were setup with better factory parts were more common throughout the 70s. Where as an olds from any year after 70, is well suspect for junky cranks, small valves so that makes Buick a bet in one sense, however that varies with how fast the guy wants to go. In this realm of super fast street motors with semi stock parts Pontiac blows both olds and buick away in terms of all out potential. You may or may not know this, but in the last part of the 70s, a Pontiac transam could be had with either a Pontiac or an Olds No big secret there what was the one to have, although some guys like s, they generally blow up.
As a side note since you are a chevy guy think about this. Starting in a guy could get an F body Chevy Camaro SS with a big block, but only in 70 and only a By 73, chevy Camaro was only available with a small valve low compressionhowever that same year, in a Trans Am, Pontiac offered not only abut a really, really nasty with racing pieces that were never before offered in any other pontiac at anytime before or after 73 and My personal thought on this. Made the 69 Z28 I had just gotten done with look like a joke.
So that right there made me realize why a Camaro would have been just to much for the general public and how stock for stock the Chevy made those other engines looked like second stringers.
About 25 years ago a friend of mine in the same shop built side by side two motors. I built and Olds and he built a Chevy Everything in that Chevy made my parts look sad. I was intrigued by this, but in reality seeing the differences in the construction there was no way I could have even compared the two motors. The big chevy was superior in every respect. Kinda made me turn Chevy, and I still love Rat stuff, and Olds is nice, and I love them for what they are, but are not Rat chevies and the pontiac and buick are equally sad by way of comparison.
Pontiac diehards would be hard pressed to put a Chevy motor in their pride and joy, and I respect that. Have you ever been over to the oldsmobile forum? They ostracize anyone who uses anything other than an olds motor in an olds.Go to Page Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick!
Some forums can only be seen by registered members. Ihad a olds 98 that i beat every day for about a year and a half ,and i never hurt that engine. Just my opinion ,i think that was a better built engine that the buick pontiac engine. Ihad all 3 brands and the buicks had oil pressure problems,the ponchos had timing chain problems. Stock for stock i think the oldsmobile engines held up better. Now i had all three engine brands ,and all were torque engines.
Had a 68 grand-prix with the and highway gears that made my take off pretty slow. But after you get up to about mph and floor it it comes on like a cannon. Loved that car on the highway. The 98 would brake torque like crazy. Originally Posted by Bideshi.1970 Chevrolet Corvette 454 LS5 vs 1970 Buick GS 455 - Pure Stock Muscle Car Drag Race
As cited above, they didn't have very good breathing heads. Even the Pontiac Super Duty heads were anemic compared to a big block ChevyFord andor Chrysler wedge. Originally Posted by PDD. Common sense says you can build more power with more cubes.
But that is not what the OP asked. They're are lots of Die Hard Ford guys who worship the SO but the Series makes more power because it is a better breathing engine just like the BB Chevy breathes better than the old Buick, Pontiac, Olds engines. Originally Posted by Mopac I never knew these engines I've mentioned in the OP didn't have very good breathing heads and that the Pontiac Super Duty were anemic compared to the better known big block ChevyFord and and the Chrysler motor, you sure don't hear a lot about the Pontiac 's and now I can see why.
I did have a feeling that the BuickPontiac and the Oldsmobile 's were torque motors rather than high performance motors, wasn't that also the case with the Ford engine?The Buick and Oldsmobile cubic-inch V-8 engines are separate powerplants produced by the two automakers under the General Motors umbrella.
Each featured different bore and stroke dimensions and horsepower ratings. The two s were clearly Buick and Oldsmobile's answer to the muscle car rate of the s and early s, but neither automaker received credit for producing performance street cars. Rather, Chevrolet's more popular and Chrysler's Hemi V-8s overshadowed the s. Chevys were equipped with the and V-8s, while Ford and Mercurys received the and Boss These cars emerged as icons in the muscle car era because of their sporty bodies and sport-tuned Super Sport, Shelby and Mopar performance packages.
Buick and Oldsmobile were different kettles of fish. They were high-end luxury-oriented with a reputation as a car for the grandparents. Buick produced its cubic-inch V-8 from to The came to be after General Motors lifted its ban on equipping intermediate cars with V-8s larger than cubic inches. Based on the and V-8s, the Buick had a 4. The standard wielded horsepower and the performance Stage 1 version developedalthough testing on many Buick s put the horsepower rating closer to However, what made the special was its torque rating of foot-pounds, more than any other engine on the road in The Riviera's generated horsepower to achieve 0 to 60 mph in 7.
The glory period was short-lived. Tighter emission control standards and high insurance premiums in forced Buick to detune the engine to horsepower in the Riviera and on the Gran Sport models. The horsepower equipped Gran Sport clocked 0 to 60 mph in 8. Bythe generated only horsepower. Oldsmobile's was produced from to as the Rocket It featured a 4. The Rocket featured a The performance W package was for the Cutlass models.Buicks are pretty good, if not great.
That's an opinion long held at CC dating back to the time we swapped an old Electra motor into a Skylark wagon for summer fun, and then again when the Buick beat all comers in the now legendary CC shootout of all the GM corporate big-blocks. Sadly, the state of gearhead living has changed drastically over the last five years, and even here in SoCal, the Buick engine donors just aren't in the 'yards or on the streets like they used to be.
In fact, when Editor Glad did finally score a junkyard while planning for this latest Buick story, the block turned out to be damaged beyond repair. Instead, the engine core we used came from the voice of the industry, Dave McClelland, who keeps a few in stock to feed his original '70 GS four-speed convertible.
With Buick cores starting to thin out, we figure you'd better get it right when you build one, not only to preserve the breed but also to live up to the Hemi-stomping heritage with some real street power. That's what this story is here for--to deliver the facts about what works and what doesn't on a simple, budget-built We prowled the Buick message boards to learn what cams, heads, and intakes were most asked about, and those are the parts we'll test here for your edification.
We'll give you the dyno-proven power using multiple combinations of two cams, four intakes, and three sets of heads. This month we'll kick it off with cam and intake testing using stock iron Stage 1-style heads, and next month you'll see how the iron heads stack up against the Edelbrocks and the entry-level aluminum offerings from TA Performance. Speaking of TA, we've got to thank Mike Tomaszewski over there, as well as local Buick fan and owner of a 9-second, naturally aspirated GS Bruce Kent, both of whom loaned us parts and expertise.
The combo is as basic as it can get and easily duplicated. The Buick s were launched in with On our test engine, the compression represents what you'll get from a stock '71 to '76 junkyard or what is running in your Buick right now. The Speed-Pro LF pistons start life with The compression height is 1. That adds up to pistons that are 0. Work those numbers with the 70cc chambers in the iron heads used this month and the compression ratio is just 8. The heads we used are the stock, reconditioned units from TA Performance, and they use the Stage 1 valve sizes of 2.
The regular production heads are the same casting as Stage 1 heads but use smaller 2. The '75 to '76 castings have factory 78cc chambers and are never used by TA. The '70 heads are 68 cc, and the '71 to '74 units have 71cc chambers that are milled to 69 to 70 cc during the rebuild process. Our engine uses a bone-stock oiling system, though we found that even the low-volume oil pump gear needed to be shaved 0.
All our testing was done using an internally balanced flywheel borrowed from Bruce Kent, a Meziere electric water pump, Rockett Brand octane gas, an MSD ignition, E3 spark plugs, and a set of Hooker headers coated by Jet-Hot.
We used a Holley cfm Street HP carb for every test, and it was determined through testing that 32 degrees of total timing made the most power. The lobe-separation angle is degrees, and valve lift is 0.